More on High Gasoline Prices

[Essex502]

Originally posted by Seadog
1. Gas is cheaper than it was 10 years ago based on adjusted dollars.
2. The increased restrictions and jumbled regulations means no incentives to build new refineries. In fact, they predict that the new diesel regulations will put many of the smaller refineries out of business. It would cost the big oil companies billions to add capacity and take years after spending big bucks to fight the environmental challenges. The refineries sell to the highest bidder. If they do nothing, they can sell all they make, but if they spend all that money to expand capacity, the price may go down to where you are not making a profit because of the high debt load.
3. China has increased the amount of oil they use to the point where they are second to our usage now. If we do not pay the going price, guess who will. To save money, we have bought everything "Made in China" and now it has come back to bite us.
It is foolish to blame the oil companies. They are not holding a gun to your heads. You can get rid of your boats and big trucks and drive around in cars that get 40 mpg. If most people did that, then the price of gas would go down from lack of demand.
Seadog....not according to this website: http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/st..._adjusted.html (Historical Gasoline Prices)

[Essex502]

Originally posted by HighRoller
So Bush gets blamed for the gas prices now? So what if he's an OIL MAN, good grief he was from Texas. What else do they have to do there? I still haven't seen how his connections and insider knowledge have helped him in any way. As a matter of fact, if he were actually a powerful OIL MAN he'd be able to pull some strings and get the prices to drop. The problem is simple. The oil companies are more powerful and have more money than anyone in government. How many times have they "vowed to investigate rumors of price fixing" in the oil industry? Have the investigations ever gone anywhere? No, because the oil companies are smart and use some of that pile of money to make big fat contributions to EVERYONE in congress. There isn't one of those greedy bastards, Dem or Repub, that's going to stand up to the oil companies anytime soon so get over it. They're screwing us for one reason;BECAUSE THEY CAN!!!!!
Who's blaming Bush....except to say he doesn't care.
Reference:
"Senator Carl Levin recently completed Senate subcommittee hearings into the same 2001 summer price spikes and into market conditions which have boosted the average gallon price since early January of this year. The subcommittee's investigation suggested that mergers and consolidations in the industry, as well as industry practices such as zone pricing, manipulation of the gasoline supply to maximize profit, and price setting in response to competitors rather than costs of production have contributed to high prices. Senator Levin suggested that these practices, while not presently illegal, ought to be considered an "anti-competitive act."
FTC found price manipulation in the midwest gas price increases in 2001

[Dave C]

here is some interesting stuff.
ca govt gas data (http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/margins/index.html)
according to them currently,
$0.90/ gallon is the cost of crude oil,
0.74/ gallon is the cost of refinery/profit.
BOTH #'s are historically high.
plus
0.16/gal - sales tax
0.18/gal - state gas tax
0.15/gal - federal gas tax
0.03/gal - distribution costs.

[framer1]

Who's ever fault it is it's breaking the back of the working man. The money he used to take is wife out to dinner on friday night is going in his gas tank. It really sucks.

[Boozer]

Originally posted by framer1
Who's ever fault it is it's breaking the back of the working man. The money he used to take is wife out to dinner on friday night is going in his gas tank. It really sucks.
So much for that 2.5% raise the working man got this year.

[Blown 472]

Originally posted by HUFFPOWER
GEE, A LITTLE GOUGING, WHERE'S YOUR GOVERNOR NOW.
http://www.democracynow.org/article....3/10/06/160254
Right here, he is.

[Essex502]

Originally posted by Dave C
here is some interesting stuff.
ca govt gas data (http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/margins/index.html)
according to them currently,
$0.90/ gallon is the cost of crude oil,
0.74/ gallon is the cost of refinery/profit.
BOTH #'s are historically high.
plus
0.16/gal - sales tax
0.18/gal - state gas tax
0.15/gal - federal gas tax
0.03/gal - distribution costs.
Good data, Dave. Can't wait to see the numbers rise some more...does anyone want to explain why the refinery profit as a percentage of total price keeps increasing? From $0.24 /gallon Jan 4, 2004 to $0.74 / gallon now? This is profiteering pure and simple.

[rrrr]

Here's the real answer:
The debate in the presidential campaign over crude oil supplies misses the point, ConocoPhillips Chief Executive James Mulva, 57, said at a meeting with reporters this month. ``There is plenty of oil on world markets. It's a question of limited refining capacity.''
Between 1977 and 2002, the number of U.S. refineries dropped to 153 from 282. Refining capacity over that period has increased 2.4 percent to 16.8 million barrels a day from 16.4 million barrels a day, according to the Energy Department. U.S. demand for gasoline has grown 27 percent in that period.
ConocoPhillips, which produces a sixth of the nation's gasoline, said its plants are operating at 97 percent of capacity. No new refineries have been built in the U.S. since 1976 because of the difficulty in getting approval to build plants and the cost of construction, said Drevna of the National Petrochemical & Refiners Association.
If an oil company decides to build a refinery today, I suspect it wouldn't be online for 5-7 years. Now, whether the bit about approval difficulties and cost is true, who knows?
The oil companies may have made a long term strategic decision to avoid construction of new refineries so prices would be squeezed higher.

[MagicMtnDan]

Originally posted by summerlove
if this were the clinton or any other democratic admin you sure as he$$ would not be defending them, now would you MMD?
My god man, don't you ever question anything? You're too wound up - go buy yourself a big tall glass of reality!
Let me get this straight - I'm defending Bush in light of higher gas prices? When did I do that?
Bush isn't the problem in regard to gas prices. The government can't control product prices the market does that. Yes the government (your beloved Clinton and Bush both) allowed the gas companies to merge which made for less competition and that hurt everyone. But what do you expect from politicians? If they were good at managing money and bureacracy they'd be doing it in the private sector making a LOT more money!
I'm not blindly supporting Bush. I'm not at all happy with a lot of things he and his administration are doing. But he and his administration on their worst day are far better for me, my family and this country than John I'll-raise-your-taxes Kerry on his best day.
Go ahead and vote Democratic. Enjoy your tax increases and enjoy paying for "free healthcare for everyone" which means you want the government to pay the way for those who won't work. And it will be the biggest black hole in the history of this country. "Free healthcare" (no such thing) will take this country around a corner financially that it will NEVER return from.
If you Kerry supporters think paying higher taxes is such a great idea why don't you all start paying additional taxes now?! Don't wait for the election - the federal and state treasuries will be happy to cash your check each month and spend the money somewhere. Or maybe you can just find a homeless dude and start paying for his healthcare each month.

[Essex502]

Originally posted by rrrr
Here's the real answer:
If an oil company decides to build a refinery today, I suspect it wouldn't be online for 5-7 years. Now, whether the bit about approval difficulties and cost is true, who knows?
The oil companies may have made a long term strategic decision to avoid construction of new refineries so prices would be squeezed higher.
What the govenment has to do, IMO, is stop the consolidation and prevent any closing of refineries - starting with the proposed closure of the most profitable refinery Shell Oil runs - namely Bakersfield. It produces 2% of all the gasoline consumed in California and 6% of the diesel. We cannot allow this plant to close. This will only squeeze the supply even more. With refineries in the U.S. running at 97% capacity now, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to guess where the prices of gasoline will go after Bakersfield - or any other refinery - closes its doors.
All politics aside - both the past Democratic administration and the present Republican administration are to fault for not having the foresight to see this coming. It is exactly what happened in the electrical generation industry.
Another note...who did Cheney meet with, in secret, concerning energy policy? Were refineries discussed? We will never know.